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edgewalker69

so does the king

edgewalker69

the state

edgewalker69

The law push progress

edgewalker69

Like the slaves of the USA in the civil war, the rights of every man to pursue happiness, well slaves are men too

edgewalker69

Well in religions, law come from god, right? The King rule by divine right, so if god says; your sins are between you and god, and that is enforced by the state in order to legitimize one's own right to rule.

edgewalker69

They could in Rome

edgewalker69

But within the family, the father could not kill his own children

edgewalker69

The king held absolute control over life and death, but only to the extent sanctioned by his nobles and peers, no man is an island and rule alone.

edgewalker69

What part?

edgewalker69

Not true?

edgewalker69

WutFace

edgewalker69

Well accroding to some, Jesus Christ Kappa

edgewalker69

Well no, it didnt remain the same, it evolved. In Rome the father held complete control over life and death within the family, and no man could legally tell him otherwise, this is not the case under feudalism, so what changed?

edgewalker69

Usually such rewards come for military support or coin

edgewalker69

That is the idealistic version of capitalisim

edgewalker69

I agree, but under feudalism, the hierarchy of the family remained the same, the social mobility none existent, yet we broke that in the west, right?

edgewalker69

I am not a Christian, but one must wonder why in the Christian world do we value the individual, and not in say Mongolia?

nosliwreborn

Good, I had a grilled cheese not long ago, you?

edgewalker69

I got this from \"Inventing the Individual: The Origins of Western Liberalism\" By Sir. Larry Siedentop, Doctor. of philosophy, this is his analysis, I am telling you.

edgewalker69

I dont disagree on this biological essentialist view, but what you are saying and what I am saying can be true at the same time.

nosliwreborn

Greetings exalted one

edgewalker69

It is a collection of families

edgewalker69

What is a tribe?

edgewalker69

No

edgewalker69

That you were in fact NOt be judge on others action, but before god

edgewalker69

This John the Apostles account, where he is send from Rome to Damascus to persecute the followers of jesus, and on the road, he realise what the concept of the individual is

edgewalker69

This is till the same in the middeleast

edgewalker69

So if you insulted someone from another family, your family was fair game

edgewalker69

In Rome, the concept of the individual did not exist, you were part of your family, and everything you did reflected on your family and its honor.

edgewalker69

Remember I told you the concept of the \"nation\" \"tribe\" \"clan\" and \"family\" may offer some insight into this issue. The game changer for the west, is the emergence of Jesus Christ, believe it or not.

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